“How to stop a data center” :: a community in Chile blocked Google https://disconnect.blog/how-to-stop-a-data-center/
@deflarerOfClouds @becha That was used as an argument before faceb00k built their centres here in the nordics. But in the end it was to expensive for them to connect to the district heating. So now they are built and used a huge ammount of the tax payer payed reneweables put up. And i guess the NSA bro's are happy as well, with the cable collaboration with the goverment. So yes, in principle. But the centers are not built for and by the community...
@jowek do you have a link to this story? i am collecting them, here: https://wiki.techinc.nl/Sustainability#Data_Centers
@becha My analysis is that the reason of the data centers in denmark, in this case facebook in the city of Odense is:
1)stable energy source 1.a) with high level of renewables. 2) Proximity to the backbone cables 3) Skilled workforce in the construction process (though the proces was run in a way, were there was a high level of control, and very little trust in the skilled workers..., so maybe thats a stretch)
4) low levels of naturcatastrophes (erathqueakes etc.)
5) stable water source
@becha Here is a story telling that the heat will be delivered: https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/en/news/facebook-begins-data-center-and-district-heating-expansion-odense-denmark/
And that was used as a political argument, for the sustainability in the project, and in general.
@becha Here is an recent article, telling that it has'nt been done.
https://politiken.dk/danmark/politik/art9661201/I-Odense-laver-Facebooks-servere-varme-nok-til-11.000-hjem-Snart-risikerer-man-at-sende-varmen-ud-i-intetheden
Paywalled, and in danish though. The reason are laws regulating the area, so the potential expenditure from reusing the heated water, may never affect the prices. So, as i understand it, prices should be kept as low as possible and be on marketlevel and competitive, and saved energy for an economic cost is not a argument to raise prices.
@becha So the situation is that facebook have som semi-heated water, that needs further heating to be usable to send to homes, so it in reality it wont be free heating, there still needs to be heated on the water, so the result from an economic perspective is that there is no businesscase for the investment, which means it will be an expenditure in the short run, which means its not legal - even though it makes sense purely energy wise/ reality.
@becha The result is that the laws are maybe good intetions, but in a situation where investments and innovation is need, they dont make sense. And the article describe that they are rightly critized for that.
The question is the if facebook knew that, and speculated in it, and/or in the proces has acted in a way so it would be the end result; to be stopped by those laws.
And thats an analysis that needs to be made and documented, if so.
But:heating was promised before, and heating is not now
@becha 2020/Before:
"Our datacenter in Odense will generate heat at a level not reached anywhere in the world"
https://tech.facebook.com/engineering/2020/07/odense-data-center-2/
https://fyens.dk/forside/facebook-bekraefter-varme-paa-vej-til-6900-husstande-i-odense-2022-12-20
"Facebook confirms:heat on its way to 6900 houses in odense"
@becha some key points:
> Google's datacentre was expected to use "169 liters of water per second"
> water rights are private in Chile (...) So you can have situations where mining companies can use a lot of water, but next to it the community doesn’t have basic access to water
> companies such as Google don’t make decisions necessarily based on what’s more environmentally sustainable, but rather what’s cheaper. And in this case, it was water
> So it could be that maybe Google was going to build this data center and the community would have to rely on water trucks
> If you look at the environmental reports of companies such as Google or Microsoft, they are increasingly incorporating water. But those reports do not break down water consumption by region as they are already doing for other figures such as greenhouse gas emissions.